Victoria NeuroNotes

“Little Children Are Not Too Little To Go To Hell” – Claims New Children’s Book

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The new Christian book for children, titled “The Cage: A Young Children’s Guide to the Biblical Teaching on Hell”, was published last month. It’s written by C. Matthew McMahon, Ph.D., Th.D., a Calvinist Reformed theologian who’s written 20 other books.  His latest is a full-colored, fully illustrated book (Dr. Seuss style) promoting biblical teachings that could cause significant psychological and physiological harm to children. This would be considered an adverse childhood experience, as noted by the Center for Disease Control, yet such a hideous and inhumane teaching is allowed to be taught to children.

McMahon’s teachings represent mainstream Christianity. I’m not going to link his website, but you can access it from the link below (Friendly Atheist). According to his website, McMahon is currently a TV producer — Creative and Technical Producer for creating educational segments for the US Government’s Voice of America Network, Public Television and for CNN.

 

In the back of the book, there is a note from the author to the parents. He writes:

“Some parents may be thinking that this kind of exhortation to children will give little ones horrible nightmares… It would be better for them to have nightmares now while you teach them about the realities of hell… than to wind up in the reality of the nightmare that is hell. To the Christian parent of young children, I plead with you to… teach your children about hell and the power of God’s wrath.”

Quote from his YouTube book promo:

“Little children ought to learn all the teachings Jesus taught about in the Bible. 1/6th of everything Jesus taught about was on judgment and hell. That is a huge amount of teaching on the subject! But how do we teach our children such a hard biblical idea appropriately?

Jesus said to Israel’s teacher, Nicodemas, in John 3:3, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” This is not exclusive for adults, it applies to everyone every conceived under Adam’s original sin (see Romans 5). From the moment of conception, we have all gone astray under Adam’s original transgression. But how do we communicate this to children?

In this tastefully illustrated work that is completely in rhyme, the Bible’s teaching about hell is outlined in a very easy to understand manner. It is aimed at children 5 to 9 years old, but can certainly be read by any age. It concerns a young boy who we find is trapped in a cage called “Big Sin” and can’t escape on his own.

The cage is suspended by a chain that is rusting and could break at any moment. What will our young friend do? What is he thinking about as he stands there locked away? He sees others in cages as well, some who don’t escape, and some who jump to safety as their prisons doors are opened by a mysterious key. Will our young friend get out? How will he escape THE CAGE?”

 

Tastefully illustrated work?  You be the judge.  Check this out.

As Bo Gardiner, from “Friendly Atheist“. states: “It’s sick and depraved.”

 

child crying 2The CDC study, regarding toxic stress, (adverse childhood experiences) notes:

“The ACE Study findings suggest that certain experiences are major risk factors for the leading causes of illness and death as well as poor quality of life in the United States.

It is critical to understand how some of the worst health and social problems in our nation can arise as a consequence of adverse childhood experiences.”

 

 Brain Development and Early Experiences

“Our brains are sculpted by our early experiences. Maltreatment is a chisel that shapes a brain to contend with strife, but at the cost of deep, enduring wounds. —Dr. Martin H. Teicher

From Child Welfare.gov:

“Brief periods of moderate, predictable stress are not problematic; in fact, they prepare the child to cope with the general world. The body’s survival actually depends upon the ability to mount a response to stress (Shonkoff & Phillips, 2000). But prolonged, severe, or unpredictable stress—including abuse and neglect—during a child’s early years is problematic. The brain’s development can literally be altered by these experiences, resulting in negative impacts on the child’s physical, cognitive, emotional, and social growth.

Extreme Anxiety and Depression

Chronic stress or repeated traumas can result in a number of biological reactions. Neurochemical systems are affected which can cause a cascade of changes in attention, impulse control, sleep, and fine motor control (Perry, 2000a; 2000c).

Chronic activation of certain parts of the brain involved in the fear response (such as the hypo-thalamic-pituitary-adrenal [HPA] axis) can “wear out” other parts of the brain such as the hippocampus, which is involved in cognition and memory (Perry, 2000c).

Early experiences of trauma can also interfere with the development of the subcortical and limbic systems which can result in extreme anxiety, depression, and difficulty forming attachments to other people (Shore, 1997). And chronic activation of the neural pathways involved in the fear response can create permanent “memories” which shape the child’s perception of and response to his environment.

Hyper-arousal

When a child is exposed to chronic, traumatic stress, his brain sensitizes the pathways for the fear response and literally creates memories such that his fear response becomes almost automatic; he doesn’t really think about it. This is called a state of “hyper-arousal.” His brain has adapted to a world that is unpredictable and dangerous; it is hyper-vigilant, focused on non-verbal cues that may be threatening (Perry, 1996). The regions of the brain involved in the hyper-arousal response are always “on,” and because of this, the child may frequently experience hyperactivity, anxiety, impulsivity, and sleep problems (Perry, Pollard, Blakely, Baker & Vigilante, 1995).”
scared child
When Christian parents, clergy and Sunday school teachers (no matter the denomination) teach children the doctrine of hell — eternal punishment, it IS child abuse.  Again, quoting Bo Gardiner:
“This is surely one of the most evil ideologies ever formed in the minds of men.”
I couldn’t agree more. 😦
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Author: NeuroNotes

Victoria predominately blogs about religion, and the brain's role in religious type experiences.

298 thoughts on ““Little Children Are Not Too Little To Go To Hell” – Claims New Children’s Book

  1. I do not like green eggs and ham;
    I do not like them, Sam-I-Am.
    I do not like them in a tub;
    I do not like them on a sub;
    I will not eat them in a pub,
    Or even with Beelzebub…

    Liked by 6 people

  2. Christianity creates a problem, then finds measures to solve the problem. In this case, scare the children shitless, that way they will hardly be able to think clearly. They will see ghosts where there are none.
    Religion as taught in America is sick.

    Liked by 5 people

  3. There are plenty of small children living a hell of abusive parents & this self-proclaimed Christian guy wants to fatten his own pocket selling a line of full-color books that tell children they’re going to spend eternity in hell. If he really was as Christian as he pretended to be, he’d forgo the money and do something to really save kids from that very real hell.

    Liked by 6 people

    • Hi Cara, welcome. What Christian isn’t self-proclaimed? He’s teaching exactly what’s in the Christian’s guild book — the Bible. Most Christians (at least hear in America) are taught that hell is a real place Have you seen this?

      “We wanted to introduce our children to christianity in a way that doesn’t threaten them or coax them into thinking these stories are real.”

      Liked by 4 people

      • Yeah, Christians in America believe hell is a real place, with the fire and the guy with pointy hooves (complete with pitchfork). But to tell small children that they’re going there before they’ve even done anything (yes, I’ve heard of original sin) bad enough to deserve to be sent to their rooms, that’s pure evil in and of itself.

        Liked by 2 people

      • You know, I think this kind of thing (book) is probably a good idea. I have two kids who are 7 and 9 who already believe that Jesus saved them from their “sins.” That was partly my doing but now even though I’m not a Christian anymore their dad is and so are their grandparents who regularly take them to church. This whole thing makes me feel really sick inside as I don’t know exactly what to do about it.

        This book actually totally offends me even though I think it’s a good idea. Perhaps because I don’t like labelling my former beliefs as “myth.” That’s very upsetting. It’s easier for me to say that I was mistaken or that I have evolved in my thinking. But yet I have this hyper awareness now that my kids may be learning ideas which, yes, I would consider abusive. It feels ridiculous to just pull them out of church or to just declare, “No everything you were taught (even by me) and everything you now believe is wrong.” My kids don’t even know that I no longer believe and I don’t know how to talk to them about it given that everyone else in their life teaches them that non-believers are “lost” and that we should pray for their souls.

        This is a very touchy subject. :-/

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        • Just to clarify the book I was referring to throughout my comment was the Christian mythology one.

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        • “Perhaps because I don’t like labelling my former beliefs as “myth.” That’s very upsetting.”

          That’s understandable. I didn’t come to terms with it being a myth for several years after my deconversion. I simply could no longer worship or give my loyalties to such a deity as the Biblical god. I came to realize I had higher ethical standards. Now we have significant evidence that the first five books of the Bible are fiction, and that impacts the credibility of Jesus and Paul who spoke of Moses and Abraham.

          You wrote: “even though I’m not a Christian anymore their dad is and so are their grandparents who regularly take them to church. This whole thing makes me feel really sick inside as I don’t know exactly what to do about it.”

          I’m so sorry that you are going through this difficult period. I feel fortunate in that when I went through my deconversion while my daughter was away at college. After college she came home and we had a “girl’s night out”, at home, and shared a bottle of wine. As it turns out, we both had deconverted and neither of us influenced the other. We laughed ’til we cried. She was scared to tell me, and I was worried how she’d react to my deconversion. I was married at the time. I was completely open with my partner, and shared what I was learning during that period of questioning and deconversion. He’d just nod his head, and say things like “that’s interesting.”

          Perhaps he thought it was a passing stage for me. When we got married, I was more devoted as a Christian than he was, but when I deconverted, he started acting more religious — like my deconversion had a backfire effect on him. Then I heard the dreaded scripture come from his lips — we were “unequally yoked”. It did put a wedge between us, and impacted our marriage. About 5 years after my deconversion we got divorced. The divorce was painful but we did part on good terms.

          I hope sharing this doesn’t discourage you. I don’t really have any advise. I know there are couples who are on opposite ends when it comes to belief or lack thereof, and they still make their relationships work.

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          • Oh no, this is not discouraging. I’m desperate for real life examples from others who have gone through this. I did find support from my step-dad (he didn’t raise me) who I just learned is an atheist. Go figure! But even though greatly supportive of me he has trouble understanding why someone would believe this craziness in the first place. I am becoming increasingly more distant from my mother-in-law who up to recently was one of my best friends. I haven’t told her but she must know something’s up as all we used to talk about was God and now I never mention it. I’m finding it unbearable to be in her presence because she seems so bigoted which is such a change to how I saw her a few months ago.

            My husband is much more open minded than I thought, or at least willing to engage in debate in matters of faith. He’s always had the ability to play “devil’s advocate” and can look at something from an opposing view and since he loves me is not automatically dismissing what I say. It’s super helpful that he can talk about the facts without getting overwhelmed with emotion. We already were having seriously problems though and I’m not sure if this will push him over the edge toward the end of our marriage. If it ends I suspect it would be my doing but we will see.

            “Unequally yoked,” how painful. I became a born-again Christian in college and learned soon after my conversion that my boyfriend, whom I was very much in love with, was an atheist. I used the “unequally yoked” on him and broke up with him. Looking back I feel like a complete ass for having the so and I have since contacted him and apologized. It still hurts and I’d have to say that decision was the first of many horrible decisions I made in the name of pursuing “God’s will.” That breakup was painful but I cannot even imagine the dissolution of a long-term partnership/marriage over faith issues and how painful that must have been. I’m so sorry.

            But I am so very happy that you and your daughter found yourselves at the same conclusion. A girls night with wine, how fun! I ❤️that.

            As far as the first five books being fiction. You know, I do think it is, but I haven’t looked into it. For me I perhaps worked opposite than most. I am rejecting the Gospel message and the New Testament. I suppose I’ve probably always seem the Old Testament as fables and stories. I guess I figured that the God I knew was in there but it was “recorded” wrong.

            Now I am looking at Jesus’ words and I don’t understand how people can see him as this peace-loving non-judgmental hippie. No, he was very divisive.

            I apologize that my commenting is all over the place. It is late and it seems as if my brain wants to challenge all its previous beliefs at once. I’d best get some sleep. I suspect I’ll have some fascinating dreams tonight!

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  4. Excellent post on a disgustingly abusive topic. What a horrid thing to do to children. If there’s a real “evil” out there, it’s shit like this. Horrible.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Thanks Jeff. It is so disheartening that this form of child abuse is perfectly legal in America.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Lovely thoughts to put in kid’s heads.

        Liked by 1 person

        • From Psychologist Valerie Tarico: Excerpt from Psychological Harms of Bible-Believing Christianity

          “Why Harm Goes Unrecognized. What is the sum cost of having millions of people holding to a misogynist, authoritarian, fear-based supernatural view of the universe? The consequences are far-reaching, even global, but many are hidden, for two reasons.

          One is the nature of the trauma itself. Unlike other harm, such as physical beating or sexual abuse, the injury is far from obvious to the victim, who has been taught to self-blame. It’s as if a person black and blue from a caning were to think it was self-inflicted.

          The second reason that religious harm goes unrecognized is that Christianity is still the cultural backdrop for the indoctrination. While the larger society may not be fundamentalist, references to God and faith abound. The Bible gets used to swear in witnesses and even the U.S. president. Common phrases are “God willing,” “God bless,” “God helps those that help themselves,” “In God we trust,” and so forth. These lend credence to theistic authority.

          Religious trauma is difficult to see because it is camouflaged by the respectability of religion in culture. To date, parents are afforded the right to teach their own children whatever doctrines they like, no matter how heinous, degrading, or mentally unhealthy. Even helping professionals largely perceive Christianity as benign. This will need to change for treatment methods to be developed and people to get help that allows them to truly reclaim their lives.”

          Liked by 3 people

      • Not only child abuse, pretty abusive to adults as well.

        Liked by 2 people

  5. The problem is, they don’t see it as child abuse. They’ve had this evil shit drilled into their heads from an early age and are completely convinced that it’s true. The sad part is that far from seeing this as abuse, they actually think they’re doing their children a favour from saving them from going to hell by teaching them to be scared of it and what to do to avoid going there.
    So it’s a toss up as to whether to refute it by calling it child abuse (which it clearly is) or by telling everyone that there’s absolutely no reason to believe that it’s true. And that there is every reason to believe that it is the delusional ranting of superstitious, sheep-herding peasants from thousands of years ago who were so ignorant they didn’t even know that the earth revolved around the sun or that the universe was made up of anything other than the sun, moon and earth. If we could just introduce the teaching of the history of religion in school (as Daniel Dennett is a proponent of), it would at least give children the tools to refute some of the stuff they’re being told. In other words, we need everyone to recognize religion for what it is. Ghastly, Tribal, cultish, illogical nonsense

    Liked by 3 people

    • “So it’s a toss up as to whether to refute it by calling it child abuse (which it clearly is) or by telling everyone that there’s absolutely no reason to believe that it’s true. And that there is every reason to believe that it is the delusional ranting of superstitious, sheep-herding peasants from thousands of years ago…”

      And those religious, tax-exempted institutions, run by clergy snake-oil salesmen who’ve gotten filthy rich while promoting child abuse.

      Liked by 2 people

  6. That is some seriously messed up stuff right there. Child abuse indeed. McMahon should be charged for inciting hate crimes against children.

    On a slightly amusing side note, anyone else notice that the book that the old man is reading to the children (about the 1:30 mark) is about wizardry? Someone didn’t check their stock footage purchase very closely 🙂

    Liked by 2 people

  7. Just, wow. Possession of this book ought to be grounds for removal of parental rights.

    Liked by 2 people

  8. Oh Victoria, that video was so disturbing it left me near speechless. Yet I’m so glad you posted this. I have trouble understanding why christians don’t see this as abusive, but I know they don’t. My parents happily taught be about hell and how jesus would save me if I loved him the right way. What a terrible thing to do to a young mind.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Hey Violet, it’s wonderful to see you back. Isn’t it interesting how desensitized our culture has become regarding this abusive teaching? During my indoctrination by “religious terrorists”, i.e. nuns and priests, I had persistent night terrors when I was a child. They got so bad my parents took me to a couple of doctors, but the doctors pretty much blew it off as being “normal”, and said I was just seeking attention. Despicable.

      Liked by 1 person

  9. Sick, demented, abusive. I think Ark is staying away from religious posts for a while, but he would throw a wobbly over this as nowhere is hell even mentioned by Jebus.

    Are child welfare groups seriously unable to step in here?

    Liked by 1 person

    • John, if parents are under the umbrella of religion, they can get away with just about anything regarding children. Recent example:

      “4-year-old Natali Joy Mudd was found dead by detectives in her own home, with a tumor in her eye that was almost as big as the rest of her head. At the horrific scene, a police sergeant found horizontal trails of blood along the walls of the house. The trails matched the height of the girl’s head. Natali had apparently been leaning against the wall as she dragged herself from room to room, blinded, trying to find a way to freedom, before the tumor killed her. (Stauth 2013).”

      Natali’s parents belonged to the Faith Assembly Church. They didn’t believe in medical care, and they were not prosecuted because Indiana had strict religious shield laws. Two years later, Natali’s five-year-old sister died from an untreated tumor in her stomach the size of a basketball. The Faith Assembly Church was responsible for as many as 100 childhood deaths.

      There are only five states with no religious exemptions for sick and injured children. 😦

      With that in mind, I simply don’t see this guy, or the parents who will buy his book and expose their children to it being prosecuted for child abuse.

      Liked by 1 person

  10. Pingback: A Walk Through the Garden of Eden | Amusing Nonsense

  11. Holy Shit! I just clicked on the link that showed the “tasteful illustrations,” and stand in abject horror. As someone said above this is a hate crime against children. To show a cage, whose chain is rusting…then it suddenly snaps, plunging the caged child into fire where other kids “weep and woe”? I can’t even believe it and am absolutely aghast.

    Liked by 2 people

  12. This is so sick. Growing up I knew a lot of adults who believed in demons and I can remember sleepless nights where I was afraid of a demon appearing. Worse, I knew other kids with the same fear well into…well, way too old if you ask me. This is such a pernicious belief to spread, and the people doing the spreading think it’s all true and that they’re being helpful.

    Liked by 1 person

  13. UGH – what disgusting teachings!

    How did we ever?

    Liked by 1 person

  14. Oh Fuck! I cannot write much more for the rage inside.
    This twat should be charged with promoting child abuse.

    Liked by 3 people

  15. Reblogged this on A Tale Unfolds and commented:
    Okay, I said I was taking a break but this needs to be shown up for it is.
    Vile child abuse, plain and simple.
    That this sort of thing can be allowed in the 21st century is so mind boggling it defies belief.

    If you call yourself a Christian then for the love of humanity prevent sick people like this man from being allowed anywhere near children.

    Liked by 2 people

  16. Reblogged this on notestoponder and commented:
    Just when I thought I’d heard it all – this comes along.

    Like

  17. This reminds me of Jesus Camp, in print. Very sad in deed.

    Liked by 2 people

  18. I went to this address where this criminal has a blog and said my bit to C. Matthew McMahon. It is an old site but he may get the comments.

    https://www.youtube.com/user/apuritansmind/discussion

    Liked by 3 people

    • I see dear Wally is now trashing you too.
      What is the matter with these people?

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        • Sends him to the spam can. SK called him out about his supposed atheism after I raised the point over a post that stated he was so upset or something about teaching his kids to be atheists or some such. There was a picture of a bloke with his head in his hands – all Woe is me type shit. But Wally later confessed ( after I pushed a bit) he never really gave up believing in God (Yahweh) he was just angry or something and he regretted ‘indoctrinating’/teaching his kids atheism. It was on his blog pal James’ blog somewhere. He returned to the Lawd after a bought of the one of the usual suspects and had his on a ”pretty girl” who went to church. So he ‘signed up ‘ again and got saved or something.
          So SKL called him out and Wally trashed his comment.

          Just below this one …
          https://truthinpalmyra.wordpress.com/2015/05/30/the-armor-of-god-part-2/comment-page-1/#comment-5352

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          • Well, my goodness Ark. You are indeed loved by Wally. You’re still around for doing the same thing SK did. Must be that stone charm. 😀

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            • Oh, not so fast …. you want to know how many of mine he has trashed and continues to do so? lol …
              Maybe he believes if he bans me he has failed?

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              • LOL — that could be true. That would be one big notch on his heavenly belt and a gigantic blast of dopamine if he thought he was responsible for helping you “seek the light”. He ain’t giving up on you. *giggles*

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                • I think friend David has left a comment here somewhere ….
                  Oh, dear.

                  Liked by 1 person

                  • Yeah, I just saw it. Pathetic.

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                    • Now he is a character Luke despises.

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                    • Yes, I’ve read his comments. Simply mind boggling that religious indoctrination has so much power over the mind — to where people lose their humanity and see nothing wrong with child abuse. Ive read several studies showing that those who abuse or support abuse, were most likely abused themselves.

                      Like

                    • David is the type that need to be watched. Preferably from a great distance.

                      Liked by 2 people

                    • Victoria,

                      You were right. MIRACLES HAPPEN! A different day–a new perspective! Hang with me…I’ll try not to meander. (And, by the way, I hope you smile a few times reading this)

                      Three days ago I went to bed thinking I was a Christian. The following day I had numerous Christians tell me I was not a Christian. Heretic, blasphemous and lost seemed to be the names they associated with me. I thought about it. And, they were right! I did not believe in the Yahweh deal, heaven, hell and especially if circumcision was necessary, well, at 57 that was out of the question. But, I still had the nagging thought of a creator. I went to bed with a question: Am I a deist?

                      So, two days ago I woke up and felt comfortable simply being a deist—and seeking to understand a creator. But, after I shared my new found vision and after lengthy exchanges with you and Ark, I was told I was not a seeker—or a deist. I was still a Christian? I could not understand it. What does it take to get this bugger off the finger? To hear this from anti-theists left an impression.

                      But, what bothered me most was something you said. You suggested I had a small hippocampus.

                      I’ve never been accused of that! I always thought I had a large one—and had been told that many times. But, going to sleep I was distraught. Did I have a small hippocampus?

                      In the middle of the night I awoke and looked on line for pills to increase the size of my hippocampus. No luck. As I sat in the chair, my exhaustion caught up with me.

                      I began to dream. I was dreaming first of riding a floating rug through the air on a midnight journey. I heard in the background, “Allahu Akbar…Allahu Akbar…Allahu Akbar” over and over in a low, monotone sound…a chant! Then, the thought of a small hippocampus struck me, momentarily causing me to fall off the floating rug and land in a bed with a hard thud.

                      As the dream continued I saw two twins—eerily similar to something I had seen in an Austin Powers movie: their names, Fuk Mi and Fuk Yu were written on their respective, tiny tight t-shirts. They were wearing nothing but the t-shirts…and huge smiles.

                      Suddenly, a banana appeared between my legs. They both began to peel it…each taking turns. Then, they began to take bites of it…but instead of the banana losing its size and girth—it kept growing larger! As they took turns I continued to hear the chants of Allahu Akbar over and over.

                      I realized a bolt of enlightenment was sweeping through me! My hippocampus was working just fine—and you were wrong…my hippocampus was huge!

                      And then, as the banana had grown to such an expansion it appeared ready to explode…I awoke!

                      “I’m a Muslim!” I said, waking my wife.

                      “Go back to sleep” she grumbled.

                      But, I knew my life had changed. A different day—a new religion! I was ecstatic!

                      After showering and getting ready to go to the bakery my wife asked, “Are you going to finish the garden work today?”

                      From nowhere, inexplicably, I responded: “Inshallah.”

                      My wife shook her head in puzzlement as I walked out the door.

                      After arriving at the bakery I greeted the regular morning crew of patrons munching on their bagels and drinking coffee.

                      “Assalamu Alaikom!” I said cheerfully, walking up to the counter.

                      Mr. Benjamin Stein, the owner of Stein’s bakery, said, “Luke, what did you just say?”

                      “Assalamu Alaikom!” I said again, even more cheerfully.

                      “Get out of here! And, don’t come back!” Mr. Stein said has he pointed me toward the door.

                      Without knowing what I was saying I uttered, “La ilaha illa Allah, Mohammadun Rasulu Allah!” With the sounds of some type of Middle Eastern language I was not familiar being screamed at me by Mr. Stein I left…bagel-less.

                      I then drove to the only mosque in the region. I walked in and asked to speak to the preacher.

                      “Preacher? I think you’re confused. This is a mosque.”

                      “I’m not confused. I woke up this morning with a vision…and realized I am a Muslim!” I said.

                      “No…no…it’s not that easy” he said shaking his head.

                      “But I had a vision. I even saw the Prophet. Do you have a piece of paper, I’ll draw him for you!” I offered.

                      “Did you say draw the Prophet?” he asked.

                      Not listening to his response, I saw many worshipers now angrily walking toward me: “Ugh, ok. Can I have a free pass…you know, a trial run to see if I like it…you know, being a Muslim?” I asked, slowly backing up toward the entry.

                      Suddenly I was surrounded by a dozen or more men shouting “Infidel! Infidel!” and pushing me out the door.

                      So, as I go to bed tonight, I know this. I’m not a Christian. I’m not a deist. And, evidently I’m not a Muslim.

                      I wonder what tomorrow holds…

                      “Rahimakallah!”

                      Peace 🙂

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • “But, what bothered me most was something you said. You suggested I had a small hippocampus.”

                      Umm, Luke, no. I shared a study with Bruce showing that the researchers found significantly greater hippocampal atrophy among Christians who said they were “born again” in comparison to Christians not claiming to be born again.

                      I don’t recall you ever saying you were “born again”. From what I can tell by our recent exchange, you’re not even a Christian follower of Christ as of today. 😛

                      What cha been smoking? 😀

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • This was a bit of humorous satire, Victoria. All due respect, I think you’re reading this with a much different “literal” perspective and missed and possibly a couple of chuckles… That was the intent (as noted in the first few words)

                      Like

                    • LOL — whooosh. What part of “wha cha been smoking 😀 ” did you not get? I think it’s you who’s taking things too literal. 😉

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • I’m just messing with you! 🙂 Emoticons are limiting! lol Have a great weekend! Best, luke

                      Like

                    • 🙂 In all sincerity (I mean this) thank you for the post–Ark and I had been chatting about this and some other indoctrination issues, this put the light on something that needs attention.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • And, on the “smoking” I’m still waiting on the approval for medical marijuana here…and waiting…and waiting… 🙂 So, when that happens–watch-out lol

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                    • Promise you’ll share? 😉

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • lol…you can count on that! 🙂

                      Like

                    • Luke, look on the bright side. Bruce says you’re a Christian, and he says he knows this because he’s got da holy spirit, so he must be right. You’re a Christian, and that settles it. Rest well. 😉

                      Liked by 2 people

                    • Again, why so serious? Drawing the prophet and conversion to Islam…do you seriously think I’m being serious lol Victoria, Victoria, I tried to offer something with a little lighter edge…something to get a chuckle. I may have failed on comedy but the intent was clearly satire… As for Bruce, he is clearly in the minority of “believers” in many ways, especially in his perspective of me lol

                      Like

      • Wally easily gets his knickers in a twist. After you had exposed the fact he never was an atheist I basically only said to him that if he had of studied science rather than listed to religious doctrine he would have been normal.

        Liked by 1 person

    • SKL, welcome. A friend of mine sent him an email, and what did she get in return? Scriptures, nothing more. I just checked out the discussion sections you posted and he’s apparently deleting anything that counters his “sincerely held beliefs”.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Victoria, even in December last year I felt Scripture had a magical impact. Last Christmas our Church had Bible readings form the four gospels for a large group of non-Christians. I was genuinely perplexed why these people did not seem to respond to ‘the pure word of God’. Just part of the Cognitive Dissonance that became too much in February this year.

        Christians are taught there is nothing more powerful than the words of the Bible. Based on that world view if one has the choice of explaining something in one’s own words or using a Bible quote; a fundamentalist will inevitably use the Bible because that is ‘God’s magic words’, rather than the flawed human thinking if they try to use their own words.

        This is the same problem I have had in engaging with Christians since my faith crumbled. They think that if only I read God’s pure Word then it will clarify everything. The point I have totally failed to communicate to any fundamentalist Christian I have engaged with since then is that when one is unsure abut the divine nature of the Bible, quoting the Bible is futile. Not one fundamentalist Christian has been prepared to address a single issue that I have raised in regard to why I question whether the Bible is truly divine.

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        • It is futile because of the nature of how indoctrination works on the brain, literally deactivating neural networks associated with critical assessment, shrinking some parts of the brain associated with memory, while increasing gray matter volume in another area associated with fear. That’s why I rarely ever engage fundamentalist Christians on their blogs. They are at a neurological disadvantage when it comes to rational discourse.

          Liked by 2 people

          • And they’re nutty whack-jobs to boot. 🙂 David here is a true example of just how frighteningly warped a brain can become from physical abuse coupled with the emotional abuse of religious indoctrination.

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            • Agreed. The religious hierarchy wire or rewire people’s brain (usually children) to a certain point, inducing a type of Stockholm syndrome, and then as adults they start indoctrinating themselves further. It’s full-proof and keeps the coffers overflowing.

              Liked by 2 people

  19. Pingback: “Little Children Are Not Too Little To Go To Hell” – Claims New Children’s Book | Scotties Toy Box

  20. WTF- what a creeper 😱😂

    Liked by 2 people

  21. This is truly evil – pity hell doesn’t in fact exist because the worthy author should certainly be consigned to it forthwith.

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    • Hey Colonialist, nice to see you here. Wished it could have been under better circumstances. Much like the horrifically inhumane, pro-child abuse Christian book “To Train Up a Child” which has sold hundreds of thousands of copies, this book will most likely sell like hotcakes, too. 😦

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  22. Wow…I didn’t think that anything could leave me speechless these days, but…wow. I suppose it’s the same mindset that drives people to take their toddlers to Klan meetings and dress them up in sheets, or drag their children to anti-abortion rallies and force them to carry graphic signs.
    It’s all child abuse, for sure…quite sickening.

    Liked by 1 person

  23. To call this child abuse is absurd and dishonest. The book is truth and it doesn’t give kids nightmares repeatedly. I know many people who were taught these exact things from a very young age and they are fine.

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    • Let me guess — your parents used the Pearl book to “discipline” you. No one in their right mind would think this book is healthy for children. What’s wrong with you? Are you a troll?

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      • David is a Young Earth Creationist, Victoria. He believes Adam and Eve were real people.

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      • Or only people in their right mind would think it is 🙂

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          • lol No I definitely am not.

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            • Yes, you are. You are promoting child abuse. I recommend you see a neurologist and get a thorough neurological workup. I’m serious, David.

              Liked by 2 people

              • Ah you are a comedian. If in fact it was child abuse I would agree with you. But you make me laugh that you are serious when you call it abuse. That’s funny stuff right there. Delusional.

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                  • Children are not harmed by the truth. But the people who don’t believe sure feel the harm when they end up in Hell. That I assure you.

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                    • You know what David? If there is a hell, I’d rather burn than serve the monster you have chosen to bow down to. I truly feel sorry for you. You sold out to a lie and the clergy are laughing all the way to the bank. Death anxiety is real, and many people experience it, but it is immoral — unethical for you to support child abuse so that you can feel assured you have a cushy place beyond the pearly gates. You’re a contributor to social dysfunction, and children are the ones who suffer the most.

                      Liked by 5 people

                    • See that perplexed look on your face David? That comes from years of cultish indoctrination (religion) and is what results when you run head first into reality. That someone such as yourself could not consider it child abuse to be filling defenseless young children, who are too young too think rationally for themselves, with the petty, evil, wicked, hateful, terrifying nonsense of hell proves a very good point. Religion poisons everything. It makes people do and say, wicked, immoral, hateful things and you’ve just proven my point for me. But oddly enough, I do have some sympathy for you because it’s very possible that you were indoctrinated the same way and now can’t help but think that way. Hell is not real except in your head. There’s no reason to believe that any of that ridiculous garbage is true. There is no possible way anyone could know that it’s true.
                      If I were you, I would take Victoria’s advice seriously and see a neurologist and/or a psychologist or psychiatrist. It’s never too late to treat your case – if you are willing.

                      Liked by 3 people

                    • child a·buse
                      noun
                      physical maltreatment or sexual molestation of a child.

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                    • I know the truth.

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              • Ma daddy went ta one’o dem der brain doctors ‘n he foun’ nuttin’ in ma daddy’s head but crumpled up ole bible paper ‘n cat poo. Hee!!! Haw!!! But did I ever luv ma daddy! He could whip da skin off yer ass wit nuttin’ more ‘n a shoe lace while recitin’ da lord’s prayer backwards. I turned out jus’ dandy ’cause ‘o him. Jus’ lookit how smart I is!

                Liked by 2 people

          • Here’s a much broader definition from the RCMP’s (Royal Canadian Mounted Police) website (they would be roughly the equivalent to the FBI in the US)

            Child abuse refers to any form of physical, psychological, social, emotional or sexual maltreatment of a child whereby the survival, safety, self-esteem, growth and development of the child are endangered. There are four main types of child abuse: neglect, emotional, physical and sexual.

            Note that it is much broader than your dictionary definition that you’ve used.

            I don’t know what “truth” you are referring to. What is “the” “truth” that you speak of? You’ll have to enlighten me.

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        • D.L Moody, perhaps the greatest evangelist of the 19th century rarely if ever preached on hell. His reasoning was that he would rather win people through love rather than fear.

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          • Spurgeon, known as the prince of preachers, preached about Hell a good bit. Jesus, greater than both of those, talked about Hell more than he talked about Heaven.

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            • Moody saw Spurgeon as his mentor, but they did not have the same preaching emphasis. Moody one criticised Spurgeon for failing to preach on the Ten Commandments.

              N.T. Wright suggests that some of the teaching of Jesus that has been interpreted as relating to hell was actually about the refuse fire outside Jerusalem and related to the temporal judgment to come upon the Jews, especially the fall of Jerusalem in 10 A.D.

              Jesus talked most about the Kingdom of God, called Kingdom of Heaven in Matthews gospel as a euphemism as Matthew appears to have been catering for Jewish sensibilities.

              In the end the real issue comes down to whether hell actually exists or not. Most people who have commented on this post assume it does not – which is why they see teaching it to children as a form of abuse. In your case, David, you see it as being a literal place, which implies people should be warned, even small children.

              I am hedging my bets on the matter. I certainly hope hell does not exist. If it does exist as a place of eternal conscious torture (which is not actually as clear from the Bible as is often suggested) then it makes me question the justice of God. Why would God torture someone for a trillion trillion years for misdeeds of say 70 years?

              Much of the Christian view of hell actually comes from an apocryphal book outside the Biblical Cannon, the Apocalypse of Peter which recounts a guided tour the Apostle Peter was allegedly given through Hell. In it he recounts seeing people being hung up by wires from the part of their anatomy most often used in sin and suspended over roasting fires. Some churches included in their list of ‘inspired’ books but overall the church concluded it was not a genuine vision.

              Liked by 1 person

              • “In the end the real issue comes down to whether hell actually exists or not. Most people who have commented on this post assume it does not ”
                This is the only position that one can default to given the complete lack of evidence. There is absolutely no reason to assume that hell is a real place. None whatsoever. The whole thing is quite clearly a man-made fabrication, dreamt up by frightened, illiterate, ignorant stone age peasants who didn’t know anything about anything. There is no reason to believe that any aspect of any religion is true. You have to turn off the parts of your brain that deal with critical thinking, logic, rationality and common sense. This is why it is absolutely not a coincidence that when you speak the devoutly religious, they can’t communicate in any meaningful way, they talk in circles and code and can’t answer questions because they have all those critical functions in their brain that would otherwise allow them to communicate like a normal human being turned off. They’re psychologically crippled. But don’t take my word for it. Go to Wally’s or CS’s blogs – 2 devoutly religious people – and see if you can make heads or tails of anything they’re saying. It’s the most profound gibberish it’s possible for a human being to write.

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            • @David
              The biblical character, Jesus of Nazareth never once used the word ”hell” ever, you fucking ignorant moronic half-wit. Jesus of Nazareth was a Jew.
              There is NO HELL in Judaism.
              He used the word Gehenna and used it as a metaphor.

              Liked by 3 people

              • Yes, used it as a metaphor correct. And we translate it as Hell.

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                • No, dipshit. Go and do some research.
                  The hell you believe you are going to is not the same that Yeshua referred to. As I said, Yeshua was a Jew. In Judaism there is no Hell.
                  The Hell you believe in is a church construct. Er … that means they they made it up. Got it? Super.

                  Liked by 2 people

                  • Yeshua changed Judaism. It is not a church construct, it is clearly there in Scripture. And I’m not going to Hell, I have accepted Christ. I pray you do the same.

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                    • Jesus never said anything about starting a new non-Judaic religion. If that was his intention why, David, didn’t he let his fellow Jews onto the fact that Moses was not a real historic character? If he’d wanted to start a new religion, to change Judaism, then wouldn’t that be the first thing he’d say?

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                    • I didn’t say he started a new religion, I said he changed the status quo.

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                    • And if that was his intention, as you are suggesting, then why wouldn’t he start at the heart of the matter: tell his fellow Jews they had it all wrong, Moses wasn’t a real person. Wouldn’t this have helped changed the status quo?

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • Well Moses was real so he couldn’t have said that. But as far as telling the Jews they had it wrong? That is precisely what he did.

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                    • Ma daddy used to tell me ’bout hell when he wuz wearin’ ass-exposing leather chaps an’ whippin’ my tender idjit ass with a paddle that had Jeebus’ face drawed on it. Da reason I be smarter than all you ding-bats dat don’t believe in hell is cuz ‘o dees beatin’s from me sadistic dad. Here’s a song he sung whilst whippin’ my young, idjit ass: “Oh, hell exists you bad little boy! Oh, yes it does! God made you to be his toy, thus sing out fer joy! If’in yer bad, like you be, god will take you far from me! He’ll burn you in a fiery pit, and I ,my boy, won’t give a shit!” Hee! Haw11 God bless christian child abuse advocates like me! We be keepn’ da world smart! Juz lookit me fer an example! Hee! Haw!

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • Changed Judaism? What are you smoking?
                      If there is no Hell as per christian spec in Judaism how the frakk could he have described it?
                      He used the word Gehenna – as a metaphor .
                      The fire referred to Gehenna. Now, try to stop being a dickhead for a couple for minutes and go and research Gehenna.
                      Currently it is a park outside Jerusalem.

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                    • He was explaining a new concept. Are you saying nobody can ever introduce something new?

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                    • New Concept?
                      First you have no evidence of this at all.
                      You don’t get to make up the frakking rules as you go along.
                      Second, I reiterate, the concept of hell was unknown in Judaism.
                      Therefore , he was using metaphor to illustrate separation.
                      Unless you can demonstrate conclusively that Yeshua was referring to a place of eternal torture you are simply pissing in the wind.

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                    • The evidence is the Bible. And Hell is a separation from God. Not sure what you think we think it is.

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                    • Absolute apologetic crap.

                      I said provide evidence that Yeshua, a Jew, was talking about the hell that is taught to Christians and especially indoctrinated fundamentalist like you.

                      I want you to point out the chapter and verse that clearly and unambiguously show the character, Jesus of Nazareth stating that failure to believe in him as the saviour will result in eternal damnation and torture in a fiery pit
                      And I want full explanation of any words you might claim he used.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • LOL that link did that Ark. Have a good day since you don’t want to be honest.

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                    • @David
                      It did not.
                      Okay , Dickhead. Listen up.
                      1.There is no mention of the creation or purpose of “hell” in the New Testament.
                      2.Nor is there any verse in the entire Bible that ever states that the penalty for ”sin” had changed from death to “hell.”

                      Sheesh I despise using these frakking terms!

                      And if the only way to salvation was via the character, Jesus of Nazareth, this would mean the rest of the population of planet earth, numbering in the hundreds of millions, was doomed to eternal damnation and torture in your ”hell”. Which would make your god a monster.
                      Jesus of Nazareth did not mention Hell. It is simply a construct.

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                    • That doesn’t make God a monster. That is what a Holy God entails. Unless we are made holy, we cannot be in his presence.

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                    • And was a person – in China for example – totally unaware of your god at the time the character Jesus of Nazareth supposedly strode through dusty Palestine avoid eternal damnation and torture?

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                    • In the NT era, if someone doesn’t trust Christ yes they are eternally damned. That is correct.

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                    • I asked how was a person in China for example, completely unaware of who this person, Jesus of Nazareth was, able to avoid eternal damnation and torture n your hell?

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • They won’t. I thought my response made that clear.

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                    • Then you are a complete idiot and a sanctimonious prick and your god is a monster.
                      Matthew 21:31

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • No, no, and no. And you took that verse way out of contest. Good job on getting it wrong. As usual.

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                    • Wrong? Context? The thought of you entering the gene pool , even at the shallow end, is enough for the rest of the human race to leave the water faster than swimmers in a Peter Benchley novel.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • Lol you aren’t very tolerant or open-minded are you?

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                    • Tolerant? Of you? Hell no!

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                    • Oh but isn’t that what people on your side of the fence expect of us? Hypocrite.

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                    • There is only so much ”idiot rope” one can pay out. You are already swinging in the breeze, David.
                      Seriously, do humanity a favour;please consider a vasectomy.

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                    • Oh and the personal attacks continue because you can’t have an honest conversation. Thanks Ark. Glad you are the epitome of respectable human beings. Have a great day.

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                    • I have told you before, they are not ad hominums but accurate character assessments and genuine health recommendations. For the good of us all.
                      And I impart this advice free of charge.
                      And you aren’t in the least bit grateful.

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                    • Accurate character assessment in your opinion. But that doesn’t make it so. And are you a doctor? If not why are you making health recommendations in the first place?

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                    • I wonder what the consensus would be?
                      Even among your own kind?
                      I suspect you might be a tad nervous of putting down any money.
                      Whereas I would be reaching for my wallet faster that you could say, Jesus came back from the dead, NOT!

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                    • To most of the world except for militant atheists like yourself, I am perfectly normal. But militant atheists are an extremely SMALL portion of the population just with very loud (obnoxious) voices.

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                    • “Most of the world” believes the earth is 10,000 years old?

                      That’s interesting….

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • “Most of the world” believes the earth is 10,000 years old?” That’s BS! The intelligent people in the world know it’s only a week old! Jeezuss! How hard is that to understand?! Praise to Allah! the One True God! Truth from the Qur’an: 5:73: “Surely, disbelievers are those who said: “Allâh is the third of the three (in a Trinity).” But there is no god but Allâh. And if they cease not from what they say, verily, a painful torment will befall the disbelievers among them.”

                      Liked by 2 people

                    • To most of the world?

                      Like several hundred million Muslims, Buddhists, Hindi, Roman Catholics, Mainstream Christians and even Manchester United supporters?
                      No, David I think you rate your rather unique brand of ”normal” just a little too highly my friend.
                      Remember, please consider a vasectomy, I implore you. I am prepared to chip in.
                      Let me know, all right?
                      And truly, I am not militant I assure you, I just enjoy telling you to fuck off.

                      Super!

                      Liked by 2 people

                    • David, it doesn’t take a doctor to know when someone has lost their moral/ethical compass. The longer you indoctrinate yourself with this anti-human trash, the more depraved you’ll become. After your comment about this book, I’d say you’ve arrived. As I said earlier, no one in their right mind thinks this is OK. After 12 years of trying, no publisher would touch this guys book, not even Christian publishers. Get a clue.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • Lost my moral ethical compass because I believe in Hell? Yeah, no.

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                    • “Lost my moral ethical compass because I believe in Hell?”

                      The same could be said for you. David, do you need someone to translate that for you?

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • context*

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                    • Context? What the fuck are you going on about now?
                      It was a straight forward question.

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                    • You didn’t ask a question. You made a statement.

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                    • I originally asked whether people in ancient China, completely unaware of your man-god, and unable to do a damn thing about it, would this man god, Jesus of Nazareth condemn them to eternal damnation and torture in the christian construct of hell?
                      That was the question.

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                    • And my answer was and still is, yes.

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                    • And That Ladies and Gentlemen, boys and girls, tells you all you ever needed to know about Christianity, the character, Jesus of Nazareth Nowhere, and the state of David’s mental health.
                      Well done David, you are a fucking champion!

                      Liked by 2 people

                    • Ark you can mock me all you want. I don’t care. One day you will know that I am right and wish you had listened. I feel sorry for you that you would choose damnation.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • Ssshh! There there … no loud noises.

                      It’s okay , David, we understand.
                      Someone, please call his wife. Or at least that woman that was hanging round his neck in the old picture.

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                    • Sssh. Mummy’s coming. Just sit tight, okay.
                      Here’s your Teddy.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • Don’t give this fella a Teddy! He’ll put it over his knee, spank it, and scare it with stories about Jeebus sending the Chinese to hell cause they never heard of him! That’s Teddy abuse, man! One day all christians will know the truth when they bow before Allah as he sends them to hell for their blasphemies against him. If only they’d listen now and save themselves from the truth found in the Qur’an:
                      3:178: “And let not the disbelievers think that Our postponing of their punishment is good for them. We postpone the punishment only so that they may increase in sinfulness. And for them is a disgracing torment.”

                      Liked by 4 people

                    • Funny how Allah and Yahweh sound so much alike…oh wait..

                      Liked by 3 people

                    • Funny how that works, eh? Only thing is, Allah would whip Yahweh’s arse in a bare-knuckle, shirtless battle ‘o the Abrahamic deities!!! Why? Cause Allah is real, and the christian blasphemies surrounding Yahweh and Jesus are just that: blasphemy. Sad that so many christians will roast in hell for their infidel-isms. Hmmm! I can smell their flesh roasting now. $Amen$

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                    • But you will bow down to Jesus and confess him as Lord in the end.

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                    • I will confess to his end? Really? How odd.

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                    • David’s link only cites parables. That ground, it keeps shifting!

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • I know. All bullshit.

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                    • No, it’s not the same. The bible is supposed to be the word of God, not a essay or novel written by mere humans. The bible apparently contains some very important instructions for us (i.e. the 10 Commandments and according to you, teachings about hell) which are to be taken literally because it is apparently true. An English novel is a story, written by an author for the purposes of entertainment, not an instruction manual from the Creator of the Universe.
                      And even if I grant your premise, that “you look at the writing style of the original, you look at the context, then you look at what it would have meant to the original audience in that time and culture”, it’s open to interpretation. You and Ark have already had a disagreement as to whether or not a certain part of the book is literal or metaphorical. The only thing I have to go on, is your say-so that it’s metaphorical. You’re going to need to do better than that to convince me that it’s a metaphor I am afraid. I need to see a rigorous methodology that can be scrutinized and un-biasedly applied that can yield predictable, repeatable results. Your opinion on the matter holds no more weight than Ark’s or mine or anyone else’s for that matter.
                      If it’s a matter of opinion, as you assert, then my original comment stands. Any set of words can mean anything that anyone wants them to mean to justify anything they want to justify.

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                    • Well Ark tends to have a very different view on the matter than people have had for the last 2,000 years.

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                    • You still have not answered my question. Why should I give your opinion on the matter more weight than Ark’s or mine or anyone else’s? I know Ark’s opinion (and mine and everyone else’s) is different than yours. There’s no dispute about that. I want to know WHY yours is supposedly correct interpretation (that it’s a metaphor) and Ark’s interpretation is incorrect. So far, all you’ve said that yours is correct because you say it’s correct. That’s not gonna cut any mustard with me. I am right because I say I am right is not an argument. It’s a baseless assertion that is correctly dismissed as such. Come talk to me when you have something more than that to offer.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • I’m not trying to convince you, nor can I. Do the research, but you have to have an open mind. Ark, and many others here do not so of course they will never find anything different.

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                    • From David: “But you will bow down to Jesus and confess him as Lord in the end.”
                      And
                      “One day you will know that I am right and wish you had listened. I feel sorry for you that you would choose damnation.”
                      BUT
                      “I’m not trying to convince you, nor can I.”
                      You aren’t trying to convince anyone of anything? Who are you trying to kid?!?!?! Please sir, quit while you are ahead. You are making yourself look like a complete fool (although the “degree” from Liberty “University” has already accomplished that task for you.) I have often wondered what Liberty University graduates do for a living. Now I know. Pretend to know things that they don’t know and run bible schools to indoctrinate others. What a waste of time. Have you ever in your life even considered the possibility that everything you’ve done to date is the glorification of a myth with no actual basis in fact? Has that thought ever crossed your mind? Judging by this statement “One day you will know that I am right…” I guess not.

                      You can tell me to “do the research” and to “keep an open mind” all you want. There is no amount of “research” that is ever going to help me distinguish between literal and metaphor in the bible. I have asked you SEVERAL TIMES for your methodology in distinguishing between the two. You keep on ducking the question and telling me to do research, that Ark thinks differently than everyone else for the last 2000 years, that it’s like reading an English novel and on and on and on, but you never provide me with an answer. All I have is your word that certain parts of the bible that you deem metaphorical are in fact metaphorical and certain parts that you deem literal are in fact literal. No one in their right mind can possibly accept a ridiculous, illogical, argument like that. You have no evidence for it, you’ve got nothing.

                      “The trouble with the world today, is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt” Bertrand Russell

                      Liked by 5 people

                    • If christians did REAL research, and truly kept an open mind, they’d see that THEY are wrong and I am RIGHT when I say, There is NO God but Allah, and Mohammad IS His prophet. From the Qur’an: 5:73: “Surely, disbelievers are those who said: “Allâh is the third of the three (in a Trinity).” But there is no god but Allâh. And if they cease not from what they say, verily, a painful torment will befall the disbelievers among them.”
                      Hell awaits all christian blasphemers. I am RIGHT and they are WRONG! Upon their demise, this they will all see as Truth. (Ain’t this a great way to converse?)

                      Liked by 2 people

                    • I don’t believe I said novel actually. And Bertrand Russell is a fool.

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                    • David says: “To most of the world except for militant atheists like yourself, I am perfectly normal”
                      That is absolutely NOT TRUE David. Surely you must have some kind of handle on what goes on in the rest of the world? Approximately 1/3 of the world describes themselves as Christians and within that subset, the descriptions of hell are as varied as the flakes of snow that fall each winter. The other 2/3 of the world, DON’T think you are “perfectly normal”. These people are not only atheists but also Jews, Muslims, Taoists, Buddhists, etc, etc. and they not only don’t believe what you believe (like me) but in many cases believe something else that is COMPELTELY INCOMPATIBLE with what you believe. It’s not just you (Christians) vs non-believers. It’s you vs OTHER TYPES of believers as well. The combined lot of us, far outnumber you (approximately 2:1). Actually, even the combined lot of other religious believers outnumber you as well.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • Are you going to answer my goddamn question or keep up the tap-dancing routine!?!?! My patience is starting to wear thin.I don’t care if you said English novel either. Put up or shut the up. This part or that part of the bible is a metaphor? Great! HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT? You know the mind of god better than Ark and me and everyone else? BULLSHIT YOU DO. You don’t know ANYTHING. You’re a delusional crack pot. You’re a stain on the underpants of society.

                      And FYI, you are entitled to your assessment of Bertrand Russell. However, anyone gets on the internet and openly proclaims that the earth is 10-15 thousand years old is definitely the fool in my opinion. Not only that, but a total ignoramus and a complete moron to boot. Anyone who gets on an open internet forum and proclaims that teaching young impressionable children about hell and frightening them half to death is a good thing, is an immoral piece of garbage as far as I am concerned.

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                    • David, your avatar has the look of one that is quite clueless. Maybe you could change it for starters.
                      Jesus, if he lived, could not have changed Judaism. He was a Jew through and through. He lived as a Jew and died a Jew- that is superstitious and ignorant as his fellows were at the time

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • You should probably read the NT again. He changed (fulfilled) the rules of Judaism to a new era of Christianity.

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                    • Would you want to point me to such a verse or chapter where he changed Judaism

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                    • Read the entire Gospels.

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                    • The blasphemy of the gospels shall lead the christian into the fires of the abyss. From The Qur’an: 9:29: “Fight against those who (1) believe not in Allâh, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allâh and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not Islam as the religion of truth among the people of the Scripture, until they pay the Jizyah [religious tax] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.”

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                    • Yeah the Qur’an isn’t the word of god. Islam is a false religion of hate.

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                    • From The Qur’an, the only true word of God: 3:56: “As to those who disbelieve, I will punish them with a severe torment in this world and in the Hereafter, and they will have no helpers.” You are being schooled in the true meaning of Hell. It is for blasphemers like yourself that it was made.

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                    • Leave the bait out long enough, and the fish always bite.

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                • Ark,

                  Welcome to Christian apologetics 101. Where words and phrases can mean whatever you want them to mean to prove any point you want to prove. And if you don’t agree with that, you’re wrong.
                  🙂

                  Liked by 1 person

                  • No that is not the case at all, but Ark clearly isn’t wanting to be honest about the context of the passages in which he refers, and apparently doesn’t know what a metaphor is.

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                    • David,

                      If you could please share with me the methodology or technique that you use to determine what’s to be taken literally in the bible, and what’s to be taken only as a metaphor. I’ve never been able to distinguish how anyone does this and I would like to learn how this is done. I was always under the impression that the bible is the word of God, but that can’t be the case if it is filled with metaphors now can it? So if you could tell me which passages are metaphorical and which are literal and how you determined which was which, I think we could carry on with an honest conversation. We don’t need to talk about every single passage of course, but perhaps just the ones concerning hell. Which of those are literal and which are metaphorical and how do you know?

                      Like

                    • How do you know if something in English is metaphorical? It’s the same. You look at the writing style of the original, you look at the context, then you look at what it would have meant to the original audience in that time and culture.

                      Like

      • Now here’s a fellow whose advocacy for this abuse illustrates just how damaging said abuse is. It creates people who think abusing children in the name ‘o da lord is a good thing because they were abused that way. “Gardarn it, Bertha! Ma daddy use’ta whip my dimpled ass wit the dull end of a huge-ass cuttin’ saw. He cried out ta Jeebus da whole while ‘e wuz doin’ it too. An’ I turned out juz dandy. Now git dem der kids out ‘er so’s I kin beat da love ‘o da lord into ’em wit dis ‘er e’lektric cord! Amen, and praise be abusin’ young’ins in da name ‘o Jeebus!! Hee Haw!!!!”

        Liked by 5 people

    • Oh look. The resident arsehole has arrived.

      Liked by 2 people

    • The ones that survive this crap become non believers. Rest assured, the time will come when such heinous garbage is considered filth, by all normal people and immorally destitute individuals like this Dickhead … and you .. are prevented from having any direct contact with children.
      I sincerely hope that eventually you are able to see how disgusting this is. Failing that I hope you are at least infertile.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Oh Ark so wrapped up in your ideas and always good for a laugh. It’s not abuse and plenty of people have “survived” it lol.

        Liked by 1 person

        • “It’s not abuse and plenty of people have “survived” it lol.”

          Clearly you didn’t.

          Like

          • Oh I am just fine.

            Like

            • You believe the earth is 4,000 years old, David. No, you are not fine.

              Liked by 1 person

            • Well, here we have two different opinions.
              Mine, I agree, is not worth much as I was never subjected to this shit. But there are quite a number – here on Victoria’s blog – who were.
              So if I had to choose I would tend to lean toward the ones that had the bad stories to tell. For if what you are promoting was good they would never have left Christianity, now would they?
              Furthermore, the christian interpretation of Hell is false, and if you had a mere smidgen of decency within you you would at least research the etymology and history of the word and the doctrine it spawned.
              If you are unsure about any aspect, simply ask me and I will tell you its history and where the christian interpretation of hell derived from. Okay?

              Liked by 1 person

          • Survivin’ a good’ ‘ole abusive christian upbringin’ iz da thing dat made me da handsome intoe-lickual giant I iz taday! I’m so gardarn tough from it, I kin eat live frogs outta a bucket witout even one of ’em hoppin’ away. Praise be Jeebus! Praise be beaten’ ur kiddies! Ain’t da world better cause folk like me is in it?! Where’d christy-anity be taday if not fer intellectual giant brained lfellers like me? I be smart, an’ you be dumb fer not seein’ it! Hee!!! Haw!!! An’ dat’s how dat iz!!

            Liked by 1 person

    • Wow — around 12 years, and now he’s been turned down so many times he decided to self-publish. I am disgusted and disheartened at the support this child abuser is getting on his forum.

      Liked by 3 people

      • It’s really difficult for me to see someone not only write this book, but to sit on it for so long. He had at least a dozen years to reconsider and reflect upon his writing and he still decided to make it public.

        I honestly have so much hurt from all of this. It affects my sleep, my parenting and even the way I communicate with my husband. People say that there is no training manual for parenting. That’s not true, it’s called childhood. You screw up your child, you screw up his or her child/ren and the damage continues for generations.

        I want people to understand something…parents who indoctrinate their children with religious bullshit are often repeat offenders. Shame, the cross, hell and sin was just a way of life for me through the Bible, prayer, worship, Church and my parents.

        I remember one of my parents’ out of town visits. We all went out for breakfast on a Sunday in the little town just south of us. I have never been there with them before and I haven’t been there with them since. The waitress serving us mentioned something about the Church crowd. I casually told her that we didn’t go to Church. At the time I was in the middle of my two year deconversion process (didn’t realize it at the time). I had not attended Church in a few weeks, but did end up going back a couple of weeks later. “But we’re looking”, tapping my arm, “but we’re looking” dad tells me to tell the waitress. That was a very stressful meal. He whined about everything. I somehow found the guts to tell him “quit your bitchin’.” I just thought he was being his usual jerk self, but then I began to do some recent reflection on that incident and others as well. Dad’s more than just a control freak. He’s embarrassed by my words, actions and appearances. He always has been and always will be. There I was trying to enjoy breakfast with my family while my parents visited and I behaved shamefully by telling someone I didn’t go to Church. I was in my late thirties, married with children, living 500 miles away from him and he was still dictating how I should live and speak.

        Dad always mocked me and corrected me and often used the concept of sin, morality, the Bible and hell as his premise to make sure I was on the “straight and narrow”. He made sure that I didn’t do or say anything that might embarrass him or bring dishonor to God.

        Children don’t need to be rebuked over every little thing. They don’t need to see images of a bloody, beaten up Jesus to be told that it’s their fault and that every time they sin they crucify Jesus again and again. Sin is simply something that is said or done that embarrasses the accuser. The person angry with the “sinner” is simply embarrassed and wants the person to pay. Don’t be fooled by words like “restoring back to the flock” or “submission” or “repentance”, These are all expressions that spiritual leaders use to justify belittling another human being. And if one refuses to submit then clergy more less excommunicate the member to the point of saying that he or she is going to hell.

        All of these emotional and mental games that ministers play with adults affects the way they parent. Often such leaders are seen as big brother, dad or uncle types to their laymen. As a result, Christians take much of what they say to heart, applying their teachings into their parenting. This sick practice has to stop.

        Liked by 3 people

        • “All of these emotional and mental games that ministers play with adults affects the way they parent.”

          I couldn’t agree more, Charity. As I delved into research about the brain during my deconversion period, it became very clear to me that the very parenting practices promoted in the bible and in mainstream churches were identical to the conditions noted in the studies that contribute to a significant increase in attachment disorders and depression in children. It’s sickening to me that they get away with it. Religious freedom vs child protection. We know what comes first in our culture, don’t we?

          Like

          • Yes, we do. However, Christians continually criticize the religious practices of Muslims. They don’t want freedom of religion, they want freedom of their religion.

            All’s not lost though. When I need a pick me up I just change religious songs and sing them.
            “Our Dog is an awesome dog!”

            “How great is our Dog! Sing with me, how great is our dog!”

            Or I replace every “Jesus” with “cheeses”.

            It’s how I deal with the drama of my past. I get a little better every time I sing them. It’s as though I’m gaining power I was never allowed to have.

            I have found that I don’t have to change anything to Sandi Patty’s songs. I don’t know why, I just find them funny now.

            Liked by 2 people

            • “Our Dog is an awesome dog!”

              Hahahahahahha, I love it.

              Like

              • “He reigns in our backyard.”

                Liked by 1 person

                • 😀

                  I’ll have you know that I have that tune stuck in my head now. lol

                  Like

                  • Hey, it’s how I get my power….laughter.

                    “Almighty, most holy dog! Faithful through the ages……glorious, almighty dog!” Do you know that one? It’s from the early nineties. “The trees of the field, the birds of the air, are silent to call out your name. The earth has no voice and I have no choice, but to magnify dog unashamed.”

                    Hey, guess what? I went to Johnny Cash’s childhood home today. Wow! Talk about hard work, poverty, drugs and rejection. His little town in Arkansas was a swamp land and was started up by the government to help those hurt by the stock market crash, as well as the droughts and floods in that same era that destroyed their farms and towns. He was brought up in a very poor family. His daddy rejected him because he liked writing poems, playing guitar and singing songs.

                    I love Johnny Cash. He has so many roots in Memphis and they barely even mention him here, it’s always about that jumpsuit loving guy. However, maybe that’s the way he wanted it. In the days of pastel suits and dresses, rhinestones and big hats, he remained the “man in black”.

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                    • Yeah, I remember that one. Peter and I were exchanging some Christian tunes we used to listen to. I told him I did the same thing as you mentioned — I replaced the words Jesus and god with other words, which is how I weaned myself off the music. It’s kinda hard to break away right away when you were once so involved in the music “ministry”, like you and I were.

                      That’s cool that you saw Johnny Cash’s childhood home. Really sad that he was rejected by his father. Was his father real religious? Cash always seemed sad to me, even when he smiled. I could see it in his eyes. Was never an Elvis fan.

                      Like

                    • I was never an Elvis fan, but I will tell you this, a trip to Graceland will show you all you need to know about him, depressed with a capital D. I was not prepared for how dark, closed and sad the place is. Then again, you and I see things differently from others.

                      I don’t think Johnny’s dad was religious, but his mother was. She couldn’t read music, but played by ear. They still have the family’s original piano at the house. Johnny’s older brother (by two to three years) was really religious, very much into the Bible and wanted to be a preacher. Because of his father’s rejection, he looked up to that brother as a mentor. It literally changed his personality when he died as a result of a table saw accident in his early teens.

                      Johnny pretty much spent all his childhood picking cotton and without electricity and indoor plumbing. From what I understand, as bad as his family’s life was at that home it was better than their previous location.

                      I have a theory about Cash and others like him in the music industry of that era. I believe that they became disillusioned with God and religion. They rebelled against God because it may have never dawned on them that the could stop believing in him altogether. Either that or they stopped believing and kept it to themselves.

                      Like

                    • That song was so sad. I guess when your life is really bad, and especially as a child, thinking that there is going to be a happy life someday (in heaven) helps them cope, gives them hope.

                      Like

  24. Just look at what is going on with the child-hoarding creeps in the Duggar “family.” The victims, his own sisters, are so indoctrinated with their crap that they are claiming that Josh, their molester, isn’t a criminal or a molester…and that’s beyond sick.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/03/jim-bob-michelle-duggar-interview_n_7505362.html

    *shudders in revulsion*

    Liked by 1 person

    • My stars, Mama is in complete denial, is she not? She says he only touched the girls through their clothes, yet…

      “However, In Touch has obtained a new police report from the Washington County Sheriff’s Office that states Josh told his father on three separate occasions that he performed sexual acts on four of his younger sisters and a family friend. The document, which isn’t as heavily redacted as previous ones, makes it clear that Josh was 15 at the time he abused a 5-year-old girl and committed at least seven acts of molestation.”

      I didn’t realize the youngest was 5 years old. I blame the parents for allowing their kids to be exposed to this type of “sex education”. Have you seen this yet? Prepare yourself for more shudders in revulsion.

      https://homeschoolersanonymous.wordpress.com/2015/05/24/atis-sex-ed-curriculum-silencing-victims-and-excusing-sex-crime/

      Liked by 2 people

    • Right, and stuff like that never happens in atheist families….good grief. He was 14, he was a kid himself.

      Like

      • 1. This isn’t an atheist family being talked about – it is a fundamentalist, bible-thumping family that claims to have “family values.” So let’s keep the focus where it belongs, shall we?

        2. 14 is a hormonal teenager. Hormonal teenagers have no fucking business touching children through their clothing or not. If he needed to touch someone, he should have been touching himself.

        Oh, wait – you people guilt-trip kids for masturbating, so… *shrug*

        Liked by 1 person

        • 1. I see you dodged the point. It’s not just a Christian problem, it’s a human (sin) problem.

          2. Never said he did, but said he was also a child himself so to call him a pedophile or a child molester for something he did while he himself was a child is a bit dishonest don’t ya think?

          Like

          • ROFL – I dodged no point, as you made none. You are trying to defend something indefensible, which means that any further dialogue with you is a waste of my precious time and energy.

            I will close with this observation: You have never had to counsel a child who was “only touched through their clothes” by a horny teenager who was guilt-tripped into thinking that masturbation is a sin. We all know by now that ‘Joshua’ engaged in incestuous, forced rape, and it was all covered-up by people who espoused “family values.” Any unwanted sexual contact is rape, yet you defend and justify it…wow.

            I will now disengage…your sickness requires distance.

            Liked by 1 person

            • His sickness requires some prison time with a guy named Bubba making him his christian bitch. Maybe then he’ll understand what rape is, but this idjit just might enjoy it. He’s demonstrated he’s that sick. If I knew where he lived, I’d contact the authorities in the area to be on the lookout for him as he’s a child-abusing sex offender. Sick, twisted bastard.

              Liked by 1 person

              • Exactly. I hope that there are no children in his immediate vicinity, and I feel sorry for any young relatives of his that are forced to bear his presence.

                People who justify abuse, and blame the victims of sexual abuse for said abuse, cannot be reasoned with – period.

                Liked by 1 person

  25. If there really was a Hell, this guy would have a front row seat.

    Liked by 1 person

  26. http://www.lulu.com/shop/c-matthew-mcmahon/the-cage-a-young-childrens-guide-to-the-biblical-teaching-on-hell/paperback/product-22157777.html

    Here’s some of the pages from the author’s horrible book.

    I don’t know what to tell you, V. On one hand I don’t want anything to do with this stuff. It took me so long to get out of it. Yet, on the other hand there’s this part of me that gets like Ark and I want to talk about the abuses as much as possible.

    I was also thinking about what kind of parent gets this for a child?! I’ve had some shitty parenting, obviously, but I think the mom or dad who gets that book is in desperate need of mental help. You know I’m not trying to be offensive, I’m very serious. It breaks my heart to see the stuff destroy people’s personal lives and their families.

    Liked by 1 person

    • I didn’t see any pages from that link, but there are a few listed on the link (“check this out”) in my OP.

      “On one hand I don’t want anything to do with this stuff. It took me so long to get out of it. Yet, on the other hand there’s this part of me that gets like Ark and I want to talk about the abuses as much as possible.”

      Yep, I totally get that. You know it took me about 7 or 8 years after my deconversion to talk about it openly. I was still trying to process my emotions after realizing I’d been duped and wasted so much of my life on a lie that many, many clergy already knew themselves but were still behind the pulpit for various reasons. I think it’s been a good outlet for me to advocate, to bring awareness, but sometimes I can still get triggers, and may need to take a break from time to time. But, for the most part, blogging about this subject and being involved in discourse has had more positives than negatives, and I’ve met some amazingly awesome people along the way, you included.

      ” You know I’m not trying to be offensive, I’m very serious. It breaks my heart to see the stuff destroy people’s personal lives and their families.”

      Me, too, Charity. If it was benign we wouldn’t be here in our spare time bringing awareness.

      Like

      • Sorry about that, I think I had to click “preview” under the book’s cover on that link.

        He’s a PHD for crying out loud! He knows what he’s doing by the stark graphics, especially the use of that shade of red. He’s doing all he can to stir strong emotion in every way possible.

        Some people have some nerve.

        Liked by 1 person

        • Yes, he knows exactly what he’s doing. I saw his resume. He’s had a lot of experience in perfecting deception.

          Like

          • Hey V,

            I think why this book in particular bothers me so much is more than just the presentation of hell to young kids, it’s telling them that they can end up there if they were to die tonight! In many denominations the age of accountability isn’t until about 12. He desires to show this garbage to kids half that age.

            I know when I was five or six years old I saw Jesus of Nazerth with my mom. I remember how dark and scary that film was to me. I just kept thinking “what are they doing to my Jesus” over and over again. Fast forward to my late thirties and my husband asks me if our oldest boy who’s that age should watch The Passion of Christ. I was going through my deconversion and though I was really trying to seek Jesus, I couldn’t show it to him! There’s something about tying such violence to someone that is supposedly so loving that’s just wrong. It’s the same reason that I would skip chapters and even books of the Bible as we had our family devotion time during those two years. I just couldn’t get into all the wrath and hate about the “God is love” that we worshiped.

            Yes, my children were indoctrinated a little by Churches and me. And unfortunately, were circumcised before coming home from the hospital after their births. I’ve often apologized to them for it and I continually try to make it right. However, it could have been so much worse. I’m glad that one of my babies just turned seven at the time and my other guy wasn’t quite four yet.

            Liked by 1 person

            • “I think why this book in particular bothers me so much is more than just the presentation of hell to young kids, it’s telling them that they can end up there if they were to die tonight!

              Exactly — ages when crucial brain development occurs and when children’s imaginations tend to be the most fertile. Children at this age are also in a very suggestive brainwave state. If you noticed on his forum, people suggested that he change the suggestive age (raise it), but he obviously didn’t listen. He’s no dummy. IMO, he knew exactly what he was doing.

              Your children are very fortunate to have a Mama like you. 🙂

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  27. The communist regimes used brainwashing techniques such as targeting the young. Political Idealism attached to fear as insurance to eliminate choice and free thinking. Indoctrinating children with the communist doctrine was taught in all the schools. The only difference is that the fear of burning in hell takes the place of a bullet in the head.

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  28. There are no fools like christians who fail to see the blasphemy of their ways: From the Qur’an: 9:29: “Fight against those who (1) believe not in Allâh, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allâh and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not Islam as the religion of truth among the people of the Scripture, until they pay the Jizyah [religious tax] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.”
    Hell is real and it awaits the christian infidel who refuses to do the research, keep an open mind, and see the Truth which is before him. Feel the fire, christian, into which Allah shall toss you after he’s made you kneel in submission before him. FEEL IT!!! It is your destiny, christian! It is your fate, christian! It is your future! With research, true research not blinded by a closed mind, you’d see this. But your failure is your inability to desire peace in Heaven with Allah. Rather you choose ignorance to the fact that you are wrong and the Qur’an right. BURN INFIDEL!!!!!! Burn!
    (The following message was brought to you by The Buddhists Organization To Save The Rainforest).

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  29. Oh Victoria.

    “If you could give Falwell and enema, he could be buried in a match box.”

    I like that quote from Christopher, but I prefer this one:

    “The empty life of this ugly little charlatan proves only one thing: that you can get away with the most extraordinary offenses to morality and to truth in this country if you’ll just get yourself called Reverend.”

    Liked by 2 people

  30. A comment from the link David posted here: Jesus: The Great Theologian of Hell:

    ——————————————-

    Gary • 2 months ago

    “Imagine what would happen if the authorities found out that cult leaders and parents in a particular cult were telling their children that if the children did not obey the rules of the cult, they would be tossed into a boiling pot of liquid fire.

    The leaders of the cult and the parents would most likely be put in jail.

    So if conservative Christian clergy and parents threaten their little children with claims that an invisible ghost god is going to burn them alive if they do not obey the church’s rules, should these clergy and parents be subjected to the same punishment as the leaders and parents of the cult?

    Should the teaching of Hellfire and damnation to children be a crime?”

    ——————————————–

    If it is taught as fact ➡ yes.

    Liked by 1 person

  31. (I’m following this on the web, not via email, so don’t have the “reply” option … but I wanted to comment on the earlier discussion between David, Ark, and Ashley.)

    David wrote (https://victorianeuronotes.wordpress.com/2015/06/03/little-children-are-not-too-little-to-go-to-hell-claims-new-childrens-book/comment-page-1/#comment-6709): “Do the research …”

    A absolutely stupendous suggestion, David! DO THE RESEARCH and you will discover that hell does not exist except in the minds of the apocalyptic writers that spewed out hundreds of writings during the post-exilic period of Jewish history. Further, the concept of after-death punishment began with the ancient Egyptians (among whom the Jewish people lived for several hundred years). Adding to their ideas were the Zoroastrians, followed by the Greeks, who put in their two cents.

    As others have pointed out, Yeshua did NOT talk about hell. He talked about Gehenna … another area where you need to “do the research” to totally understand what he was referring to.

    Sorry Victoria, for getting off-topic but whenever someone tries to defend the reality of hell, I simply can’t let it pass.

    BTW, I totally agree that teaching this concept to children is absolutely horrid … especially since it doesn’t even exist!

    Liked by 3 people

  32. This idiot C. Matthew McMahon, Ph.D., Th.D., I expect be rejected by the more intelligent Christian mothers if there is such a thing. However when you see a video of children being encouraged and induced by their stupid parents into that babbling bullshit they spew call speaking in tongues when the so called holy spirit descends upon them it comes as no surprise that this book will be accepted by the most brain dead individuals that are parents who are supposed to be protecting their children.

    The law needs to take a long hard look at this behaviour. Religious freedom goes beyond the law and allows the abuse of children. Remember when Priests were protected from prosecution by the churches and the law basically paid lip service to the paedophilia taking place? That has thankfully come to an end because of public pressure but now these sick religious extremists need to be in front of a real judge and pay for their psychological crimes against children.

    Remember one thing these people are in your communities and if they get the chance they will literally be spreading this religious filth to the vulnerable. They know they are not normal human beings because they rarely openly identify themselves to non-believers in person. Truth is they are nothing more than a secretive cult.

    Remember your history when these guys were the mainstream of Christian belief in Europe and North America and they used to burn people alive, especially the people they claimed were witches, 80% were women because the Christian Church came down on them in a huge way claiming they were not even humans. We know now that they were people who rebelled against anything to do with the crap that they were force fed by these insane people. Check out the sick religious medieval days here.
    http://www.thenazareneway.com/dark_side_of_christian_history.htm

    Liked by 4 people

  33. Victoria, Thanks for drawing attention to this issue in your excellent blog. A very good discussion as well!

    Just a note that you might consider correcting your piece to indicate that I’m the author of the piece you’ve linked to and quoted from. My name’s Bo Gardiner, not Richard. (“New Biblical Guide to Hell for Small Children is Sick and Depraved,” http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2015/05/31/new-biblical-guide-to-hell-for-small-children-is-sick-and-depraved)

    Liked by 1 person

    • Hi Bo, welcome, and thank you for your thoughtful comment and for bringing this correction to my attention. My eye was immediately drawn to the menu “Ask Richard”, so I assumed you were Richard. 😀 My apologies. I’d also like to thank you for your excellent post. I found your article on FB, shared by the Humanist Association. Needless to say, I was stunned. It’s very nice to meet you.

      Like

  34. Children before the age of knowing get to go to heaven. That age varies per child. I started talking to Jesus when I was fairly young, around 6 or 7, and have grown up with him. I taught my kids about him, but as they aged they went with the world and now all of them deny that God is real. I never used scare tactics on them, but sometimes wished I had. My childhood BFF was Catholic. She was not allowed to visit my church because her eyes would pop out and roll down the aisle. I thought her church was beautiful, but I never felt God there like I did when I sat in the woods talking to Him.

    Like

    • Hi quirkywritingcorner, welcome. Good for you for not using scare tactics on your children.

      Liked by 1 person

    • If you get a positive emotional feeling from your relationship with God then do you think this is still possible if you used fear to get them to love a being that should be the embodiment of peace and goodness? If, as a father, you told your children that they needed to clean their room or you would burn them alive would they come to love you, or just obey out of fear? Is that what a relationship with a father should be like? Is then that what a relationship with God should be like? If there is a God then God can be found through understanding the world and can be loved without the threat of eternal damnation. I am glad you didn’t use fear as a weapon against a child.

      Liked by 1 person

  35. I doubt I can add much at this point, but these are the kind of people you wish you could lock up and throw away the key. I think the hardest part for me to imagine, and ultimately the saddest is how you could look at your little children and think that they, in any way could be evil and sinners. Even at the ages of 6 and 7 as the person above said. I have known many children that age and they are as pure as the driven snow unless their parents have already fucked with their heads. Even if there was a God how could anybody not think that such a God would be unjust for sending little children to hell? This man loves himself more than he loves children, and what makes him extremely dangerous is that he has convinced himself he is doing good in this world. His entire life is geared towards a plane of existence that has no evidence to even existence (hence calling it a plane of existence makes no sense!). Here on Earth people need actual help…for this existence. He will bring nothing but fear and pain. It is the harm that happens to children that led me on the path away from theism, and no one has come up with a suitable explanation yet on how a God can let children be tortured, manipulated, and sexually abused, having done nothing but being born to love their parents and accept everything they do and say as normal.

    Liked by 1 person

  36. Amazing to see this with adult eyes – something I didn’t have the benefit of at the ripe old age of 5. Yikes!
    It’s a wonder I ever escaped at all. You know my beliefs Victoria, even with that, I spared my children the lectures on heaven and hell that were drilled into me. They don’t suffer – but, some days, I still do. Thank you for always helping me to be a voice (and mind) of reason.
    Love you!
    Michelle

    Liked by 1 person

  37. I want to blame the author and publisher for being horrible human beings, but I know it isn’t that simple. As Penn Jelitte has pointed out, if they believe it’s true and do nothing, that would make them horrible people. Their desire to mentally and emotionally scar children is the most humane thing they can think to do. That’s the part that keeps me up at night and churns my stomach.

    I spent years looking at literature and images from the JW organization. The only illustrations that have stayed with me are the ones that depicted the flood and Armageddon. And I was told that this would happen to other people! I can’t imagine the emotional toll of being told that Hell would be my fate for all eternity if I slipped up. There is seemingly no end to the pain caused by religious belief.

    Liked by 1 person

    • “There is seemingly no end to the pain caused by religious belief.”

      I know, and what’s so sad is that so many are desensitized. Wonderful to see you, Madalyn. You’ve been missed. I hope you’re having a lovely summer so far and haven’t been affected with all the flooding that’s been going on in your neck of the woods. Were you in the path of TS Bill?

      Like

  38. Pingback: “Little Children Are Not Too Little To Go To Hell” – Claims New Children’s Book | Victoria N℮ür☼N☮☂℮ṧ | Scotties Toy Box

  39. Good grief! Thank the gords my kids are grown up. I would kill someone with this book if they try to read it to a child!

    Liked by 2 people

  40. You think his book is bad? I just stumbled over that McMahon guy via this article:

    http://www.apuritansmind.com/the-christian-walk/how-to-not-foul-up-the-discipline-of-your-children-by-dr-c-matthew-mcmahon/

    Seriously. I kept waiting for the part when he’d reveal it all to be satire. When that didn’t happen, I Googled his name + “bats**t crazy,” and that’s how I arrived here. I’m still sickened thinking about this. That dude has some significant problems.

    Liked by 2 people

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